tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post1917216917834089747..comments2023-04-27T10:10:36.337-05:00Comments on Adventure Awaits: 5 Reasons Language in Fiction Should Be Wiped OutTracey Dyckhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-26526108449740892412015-08-08T20:40:36.848-05:002015-08-08T20:40:36.848-05:00(Just got back to the realm of the internet, so he...(Just got back to the realm of the internet, so here I am replying!) Yeah, I do that too with books that are interesting enough to merit a read (despite their occasional language). Ooh, Shannon Hale, you say? I've enjoyed several of her books, and Dangerous sounds great. Thanks for the recommendation!Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-75838132870288990382015-07-31T11:31:18.137-05:002015-07-31T11:31:18.137-05:00This post pretty much sums up how I feel about lan...This post pretty much sums up how I feel about language in books and movies. If the story is engaging enough, sometimes I'll just bleep it out in my head as I read, but the books would all just be so much better if the swearing wasn't there. Oh, and if you want a book where the swears are intentionally bleeped out, you should read Dangerous by Shannon Hale. (also because there is fun sic-fi epicness) :)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-61547181737123804712015-07-28T16:14:48.957-05:002015-07-28T16:14:48.957-05:00Yeah, I get what you're saying. And I think th...Yeah, I get what you're saying. And I think there does come a point, especially in books for an older/more mature audience, where *some* profanity might be justified for the reasons you mentioned. I know in the excerpts of "The Scent of Her Soul" that Bryan Davis has posted on his blog, a couple characters swore mildly. I personally have always gone the "he swore" route (unless it's a fantasy character, in which case, they can spout all sorts of fictional words).<br />The occasional language was one of my main complaints with the Divergent series too. That, and Tris's definition of "going slow" in her relationship with Four is...not exactly slow.<br />Anyway, thanks so much for your comment! :) There's a little grey in this area, I do admit.Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-91503552471309121402015-07-28T16:10:35.781-05:002015-07-28T16:10:35.781-05:00Perfect. Hopefully that's not anytime soon... ...Perfect. Hopefully that's not anytime soon... XDTracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-49588031814158747302015-07-28T15:38:19.345-05:002015-07-28T15:38:19.345-05:00Ahahaha! I love that! Next time I feel my impendin...Ahahaha! I love that! Next time I feel my impending doom approaching, that's what I'll scream. XD Rachel Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18174226975096744494noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-2574481323605422192015-07-28T11:39:24.057-05:002015-07-28T11:39:24.057-05:00I'm partially with you and partially not. Most...I'm partially with you and partially not. Most of the time I do not like swearing especially in things such as blog posts where it's public domain. In books I hate excessive swearing or just random swearing when the book would be equally as clean without it (Like the random swears in the Divergent series). I closed one book after five pages because of the f-bombs on every page. The only time when I think swearing is okay is when the characters would logically swear like, say, drug-dealing gangsters. They would have mouths they don't want to kiss their mother's with. It's just realistic. That said having them swear every other word (even if many do in real life) is a tad excessive, but have enough to give the realism I can tolerate. Other than that sole reason, I agree with your points especially the intelligence one and even then if a character would logically swear especially the protagonist a "he swore" will do.<br /><br />storitorigrace.blogspot.comVictoria Grace Howellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01849013182543674707noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-31389658042888826782015-07-28T07:27:13.370-05:002015-07-28T07:27:13.370-05:00Completely agree! It would just make sense to stop...Completely agree! It would just make sense to stop including those things in books and movies. Guaranteed, authors/moviemakers would make a lot more money off me if they went that route. XD<br /><br />It is, isn't it? I like your "stars" version. ^_^ That kind of swearing can be a great worldbuilding tool as well. In my fantasy series, I have a character swear by his country's greatest river. :P ("Great Bending River, we're all going to die!" Or something like that, lol.)Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-87543071822215593292015-07-27T23:15:11.557-05:002015-07-27T23:15:11.557-05:00I agree! I've often thought about number 4, al...I agree! I've often thought about number 4, also in relation to nudity and sex in movies, books, etc. Yeah, THESE people don't care, but THOSE people do. And THESE people can still enjoy a movie if it contains no swearing, sex, etc, but THOSE people have a harder time enjoying rampant filth. <br /><br />Anyway, YES to fantasy swearing, also! XD It's actually weirdly super fun. X) I think I've actually utilized that in my current WIP. Mostly to do with stars, I think. Stars above, Stars help him, mild stuff, even for fantasy swearing. XD Rachel Mhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18174226975096744494noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-46136221830110008082015-07-26T20:12:10.102-05:002015-07-26T20:12:10.102-05:00That 'swearing for the sake of swearing' s...That 'swearing for the sake of swearing' seems to be such a blurred line. I find it hard to pinpoint it sometimes.<br />Ooh, I can imagine that job comes with a number of pains as well as joys (<--hopefully!).<br />Thanks for popping by! :)Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-56954685063719455352015-07-26T19:26:15.589-05:002015-07-26T19:26:15.589-05:00I have no problem with profanity in literature, as...I have no problem with profanity in literature, as long as it's not just swearing for the sake of swearing (I get enough of that at work... I'm a high school teacher). Christinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02287501540207945678noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-59150735772219362882015-07-26T17:10:28.591-05:002015-07-26T17:10:28.591-05:00Yep, it's just tiring, isn't it?
That can ...Yep, it's just tiring, isn't it?<br />That can be rough when others around you swear often, but good for you for keeping your own vocabulary clean. :)<br />Me too. Thanks for commenting, Skye! :DTracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-20443454875487266572015-07-26T16:04:07.656-05:002015-07-26T16:04:07.656-05:00I personally don't swear, and it does bother m...I personally don't swear, and it does bother me that Y.A's now spew it like it's okay. <br />Here and there seems more realistic, and even then it does seem unnecessary. I can't say it bothers me too much because I do read and enjoy a lot of books, movies, and music that has swearing in it. I also have people in my life who have a bit of a potty mouth. I do try to keep my mouth clean, and my books. Because I think it can just make you seem sloppy or they can be used as fillers. <br />I personally would rather any medium not to have swearing, though.<br />:D Great post.Skye Hofferthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02385765274513034927noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-1375972963529851752015-07-26T15:04:25.394-05:002015-07-26T15:04:25.394-05:00I feel ya, girl. "Grrr" indeed! But that...I feel ya, girl. "Grrr" indeed! But that totally makes sense about old-fashioned language. Even, say, the British use of 'bloody' is something that doesn't bother me. We shall just endeavor to revolutionize fiction then, won't we? You and me all the other lovely writers I know--we will change the world! XD<br />Everything you said was spot on. :)Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-51384575648979973452015-07-26T13:13:03.135-05:002015-07-26T13:13:03.135-05:00Yes yes yes and yes! Wonderful post, Tracey! I agr...Yes yes yes and yes! Wonderful post, Tracey! I agree with this so much. Foul language often makes me very annoyed at books and I often feel like I can't recommend a book I liked otherwise. Grrrr. It makes me so annoyed. Very good points, all! There has been the occasional time when I was reading a book and there was some "older", slightly milder maybe language that did sort of fit, especially in British books of a certain era, but the times when it DID fit are very rare and far in between. Mostly it's just super on-my-nerves. -_- So many books/shows/movies/what-have-you are just sullied and ruined by people throwing in totally random language and inappropriateness and I'm just left going NO. NO NO NO. (I mean, yes, there is freedom of speech, so in that sense I'm not going to complain TOO bad. BUT STILL. Argh.) (And yes, out-of-context things are the worst where they don't even BELONG there so it's obviously just there for no reason. >.<)<br /><br />Great post, thank you! :)Deborah O'Carrollhttp://deborahocarroll.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-44318074398042403172015-07-26T11:51:05.644-05:002015-07-26T11:51:05.644-05:00Thank you! Exaaaactly--if it's not there, peop...Thank you! Exaaaactly--if it's not there, people of either viewpoint hardly notice, but when it is present, some of us balk. But here I go repeating everything you just cleverly said. XD<br /><br />Yup. So true.<br /><br />I don't know if you've heard of author Bryan Davis before, but he made an interesting remark in a post about a pitch conference he attended in New York. He was told that "...editors nowadays see profanity as too easy, ho-hum, and lacking cleverness. A good writer can provide cultural flavor and raw emotion without resorting to cursing." (http://theauthorschair.com/2015/03/25/the-new-york-city-pitch-conference-2015/)Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-90682275027374457152015-07-26T11:45:38.474-05:002015-07-26T11:45:38.474-05:00Good point there! There shouldn't really be a ...Good point there! There shouldn't really be a difference. I guess we could extend this to "Five Reasons Language Should Be Wiped Out, Period." Although, hey yeah, there's freedom of speech and all... XD<br /><br />I guess the word *itself* has no power--it is, after all, simply letters strung together. But to me, it's the meaning and intentions behind it that's the problem. The word represents something unpleasant and offensive. I understand how it doesn't bother some people, though.<br /><br />(I know! Come on, pay attention to your worldbuilding, authors! It's always a great touch when characters' diction reflects the world in which they live. Cleverness in that area is greatly appreciated by me as well.)<br /><br />Thanks so much for weighing in, Cait! :DTracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-20092032368145158102015-07-26T11:39:24.148-05:002015-07-26T11:39:24.148-05:00LOL, Christine! Yes, #4 sprang from our discussion...LOL, Christine! Yes, #4 sprang from our discussion, actually. ;) And you put it so smartly: "No one minds if they're not there, but some of definitely mind if they ARE." Very true.<br /><br />I know, right? After reading a Goldstone Wood book, I almost find myself saying "dragon's teeth" when I'm mad. XD<br /><br />Haha, glad you enjoyed it! ^_^Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-61606021924709853172015-07-26T11:30:58.022-05:002015-07-26T11:30:58.022-05:00That analogy of the ocean was simply wonderful, Tr...That analogy of the ocean was simply wonderful, Tracey! This is a fantastic post. Oh, my word. Also, when it comes to readership, group A does not see the absence of swear words the same way group B reacts to their presence. Those words are offensive to the group B readership, but it wouldn't really bother group A to have them gone. Therefore it is actually more logical to omit them and attain a wider audience.<br />Another thing to do with language is innuendos. Yeah, nothing may /happen/ in the book, but I still don't want to read what some think funny and I consider sacred.<br />Language is a mark of unintelligence and a lack of creativity. You are awesome, Tracey.<br /><br />@Blue: Wookie noises? XD That's the best!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-78682197781357181452015-07-26T06:29:57.195-05:002015-07-26T06:29:57.195-05:00So, I, erm, awkwardly have a problem with fictiona...So, I, erm, awkwardly have a problem with fictional cussing vs real cussing. I mean, what's different?? I always get confused at swearing because aren't <i>we</i> humans giving the words the power? THEY'RE JUST WORDS. XD At the same tiiiiime...I was brought up to not swear, so I basically don't! And when I write, depending on the genre, swearing just doesn't enter it. I don't think swearing is necessarily a sign of low intelligence, but I DO respect when a book limits swearing to appeal to a wider audience. But for me? Swearing makes zero problems.<br /><br />(But omg, I hate hate hate it when fantasies swear out of context. It NEEDS to be in context. I read a fantasy series with totally no deities and they kept say "oh my god" and it just bugged me <i>so much</i> because you can't USE that unless you HAVE a god in your world!! GAH. But yes, I like it when fantasies do it cleverly.)<br /><br />ANYWAY. SUCH AN INTERESTING TOPIC!! I loved reading your thoughts on this!! XDCG @ Paper Furyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14954615708675952085noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-85136604835850857722015-07-25T23:26:38.427-05:002015-07-25T23:26:38.427-05:00Can I just give a big, resounding AMEN!!!!!!
This...Can I just give a big, resounding AMEN!!!!!!<br /><br />This post. THIS POST. Yes to all the things. EVERYTHING. I was totally nodding and going "Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes!" in my head while reading it. Especially #4! I know we've talked about it before, so you know my feelings on it. But come on! If an author wants to appeal to everyone then leave out the obscenities. No one minds if they're not there, but some of us definitely mind if they ARE. So just leave 'em out!<br /><br />I've also totally thought about how it sounds way too modern in fantasy worlds. It doesn't even FIT. But things like the Goldstone Wood books were perfect and just helped build the world and make it come even more alive. It's a win, win all around.<br /><br />Basically this is one of the bestest posts ever and I wish everyone in the world would read it. Thank you for sharing, Tracey! This was perfect!Christine Smithhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15859881278385314279noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-61130164432683016562015-07-25T19:12:31.970-05:002015-07-25T19:12:31.970-05:00EXACTLY my thoughts. And I love that Lego analogy!...EXACTLY my thoughts. And I love that Lego analogy! Yes, swearing makes it super hard to find good reads . . . along with a number of other content issues, the topmost being sexual. (Blegh. Am I the only one sick and tired of the book covers featuring shirtless guys or a kissing couple?)<br /><br />That's true. And in those situations, I do unfortunately find certain words springing to mind. (On the rare occasion, they spring further, which is *not* a good thing.) Wookie noises, lol, that's the best! XD Definitely a great alternative.<br /><br />Hey, now that's an idea. That could be a lot of fun to play around with! ;D Thanks for weighing in. :)Tracey Dyckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03445222618456673198noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6620960568844915525.post-79851192355867151992015-07-25T14:43:59.234-05:002015-07-25T14:43:59.234-05:00Foul language gets on my nerves. It's not an ...Foul language gets on my nerves. It's not an easy thing to skip, and it can be scattered all over a book, like lego pieces across a floor. That is one of the many reasons why I find it so hard to find a truly great book. <br /> <br />I agree that swearing does show immaturity. But on the other hand, it seems to be human nature to shout something when angry/scared/in pain. What's an anti-swearing person to do? (for me, I end up making wookie noises. Unfortunately, I find it doesn't leave me more mature.) <br /><br />This could make interesting fiction, actually. Imagine this: A character who is intent on keeping his or her language squeaky clean, yet he or she is constantly thrust into language-inducing circumstances. How does this character react? Rather than taking the easy way and having the character spew a few curses, the writer could have some fun with the character development. Bluehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08760994961683034493noreply@blogger.com